The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

This is the main board for discussing philosophy - formal, informal and in between.

The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby JohnJBannan » Fri Apr 23, 2021 5:58 pm

The SD argument: The universe is superdeterministic based on the proof provided by quantum entanglement. Consequently, the existence of life proves life had to arise in our universe. According to Roger Penrose, there are 10^10^123 possible configurations of our universe. However, according to the mass ratio of habitable planets to the universe, only an astronomically tiny portion of possible universes could contain habitable planets. Life is not believed to be able to arise in the absence of a habitable planet. That means that the chances that our configuration of the universe with life being a random fluke is about .000003427928%. Because life is special, then a creator purposely selected our superdeterministic universe, because life must arise in it. We call this creator God.
Last edited by JohnJBannan on Fri Apr 23, 2021 6:27 pm, edited 4 times in total.
JohnJBannan
Philosopher
 
Posts: 1365
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 1:31 pm

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument

Postby Mr Reasonable » Fri Apr 23, 2021 6:12 pm

ok
You see...a pimp's love is very different from that of a square.


Dating a stripper is like eating a noisy bag of chips in church. Everyone looks at you in disgust, but deep down they want some too.
User avatar
Mr Reasonable
resident contrarian
 
Posts: 29527
Joined: Sat Mar 17, 2007 8:54 am
Location: pimping a hole straight through the stratosphere itself

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby JohnJBannan » Fri Apr 23, 2021 6:43 pm

Great physics paper proving that the universe is superdeterministic. https://www.diva-portal.org/smash/get/d ... gjelJmpAY8
JohnJBannan
Philosopher
 
Posts: 1365
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 1:31 pm

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby JohnJBannan » Fri Apr 23, 2021 6:45 pm

Neils Degrasse Tyson explains superdeterminism.https://m.youtube.com/watch?fbclid=IwAR ... e=youtu.be
JohnJBannan
Philosopher
 
Posts: 1365
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 1:31 pm

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby Ecmandu » Fri Apr 23, 2021 7:02 pm

This discussion is more complex than you make it.

Actually, in many ways, it’s simpler.

The epiphenomenon of conscious thought is evidence that existence is not determined. A determined being cannot possibly abstract non determinism.

Machine code that’s not self recursive can do things interactive, but is not sentient.

We are sentient. That changes the whole game.
Ecmandu
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 11935
Joined: Thu Dec 11, 2014 1:22 am

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby JohnJBannan » Fri Apr 23, 2021 7:21 pm

According to superdetermism, there is deterministic physics underlying indeterminate physics. The superdeterminism is in the subtle initial correlations established at the Big Bang. Basically, superdeterminism disproves biocentrism.
JohnJBannan
Philosopher
 
Posts: 1365
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 1:31 pm

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby Ecmandu » Fri Apr 23, 2021 8:48 pm

JohnJBannan wrote:According to superdetermism, there is deterministic physics underlying indeterminate physics. The superdeterminism is in the subtle initial correlations established at the Big Bang. Basically, superdeterminism disproves biocentrism.


Oh no. Don’t get me wrong. A rock is sentient. A photon is sentient.

Anything non self recursive (including computer code and platonic forms (eternal forms - the actual answer to infinite regress)) is not sentient.

Basically what you have here are a bunch of people who can’t understand that existence (including all of us) never began and never ends. They need initial cause. Initial cause will always be deistic in nature.

Even the theory of evolution is deistic in nature (the one common ancestor).

Of you want to keep going, I can keep explaining.

At this stage in my life, I’m not guessing anymore. I actually know lots of these things now.
Ecmandu
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 11935
Joined: Thu Dec 11, 2014 1:22 am

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby polishyouthgotipbanned » Fri Apr 23, 2021 10:06 pm

Penroses religion is his belief in big-bang. He talks about big-bang as if he was there when it happened.
At the beginning there was only Chaos, Night, dark Erebus, and deep Tartarus. Earth, the air and heaven had no existence. Firstly, blackwinged Night laid a germless egg in the bosom of the infinite deeps of Erebus, and from this, after the revolution of long ages, sprang the graceful Eros with his glittering golden wings, swift as the whirlwinds of the tempest. He mated in deep Tartarus with dark Chaos, winged like himself, and thus hatched forth our race, which was the first to see the light. That of the Immortals did nove yielded themselves to their lovers when almost at the end of their youth, being led away by the gift of a quail, a waterfowl, a goose, or a cock.
User avatar
polishyouthgotipbanned
Philosopher
 
Posts: 1874
Joined: Mon Dec 07, 2020 12:47 am

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby JohnJBannan » Fri Apr 23, 2021 10:45 pm

Ecmandu wrote:
JohnJBannan wrote:According to superdetermism, there is deterministic physics underlying indeterminate physics. The superdeterminism is in the subtle initial correlations established at the Big Bang. Basically, superdeterminism disproves biocentrism.


Oh no. Don’t get me wrong. A rock is sentient. A photon is sentient.

Anything non self recursive (including computer code and platonic forms (eternal forms - the actual answer to infinite regress)) is not sentient.

Basically what you have here are a bunch of people who can’t understand that existence (including all of us) never began and never ends. They need initial cause. Initial cause will always be deistic in nature.

Even the theory of evolution is deistic in nature (the one common ancestor).

Of you want to keep going, I can keep explaining.

At this stage in my life, I’m not guessing anymore. I actually know lots of these things now.


Superdetermism also disproves infinite regress. Because of retrocausality, you would need infinite information in correlations for infinite regress. There is no evidence universe is infinite. So, can’t have infinitely dense information. Ergo, can’t have infinite regress.

Indeed, the reason the universe begins in a compressed state is to maximize the density for purposes of holding as much retrocausal information as possible. The universe wouldn’t need this squeeze play, if infinite density were real. Sorry, no infinite regress. You really ought to consider superdeterminism, because it’s probably true.
JohnJBannan
Philosopher
 
Posts: 1365
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 1:31 pm

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby polishyouthgotipbanned » Fri Apr 23, 2021 11:23 pm

buddy...you cant even put a basic English sentence together properly. I somehow doubt you are an expert on physics and cosmology for some reason.
At the beginning there was only Chaos, Night, dark Erebus, and deep Tartarus. Earth, the air and heaven had no existence. Firstly, blackwinged Night laid a germless egg in the bosom of the infinite deeps of Erebus, and from this, after the revolution of long ages, sprang the graceful Eros with his glittering golden wings, swift as the whirlwinds of the tempest. He mated in deep Tartarus with dark Chaos, winged like himself, and thus hatched forth our race, which was the first to see the light. That of the Immortals did nove yielded themselves to their lovers when almost at the end of their youth, being led away by the gift of a quail, a waterfowl, a goose, or a cock.
User avatar
polishyouthgotipbanned
Philosopher
 
Posts: 1874
Joined: Mon Dec 07, 2020 12:47 am

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby Ecmandu » Sat Apr 24, 2021 2:52 am

JohnJBannan wrote:
Ecmandu wrote:
JohnJBannan wrote:According to superdetermism, there is deterministic physics underlying indeterminate physics. The superdeterminism is in the subtle initial correlations established at the Big Bang. Basically, superdeterminism disproves biocentrism.


Oh no. Don’t get me wrong. A rock is sentient. A photon is sentient.

Anything non self recursive (including computer code and platonic forms (eternal forms - the actual answer to infinite regress)) is not sentient.

Basically what you have here are a bunch of people who can’t understand that existence (including all of us) never began and never ends. They need initial cause. Initial cause will always be deistic in nature.

Even the theory of evolution is deistic in nature (the one common ancestor).

Of you want to keep going, I can keep explaining.

At this stage in my life, I’m not guessing anymore. I actually know lots of these things now.


Superdetermism also disproves infinite regress. Because of retrocausality, you would need infinite information in correlations for infinite regress. There is no evidence universe is infinite. So, can’t have infinitely dense information. Ergo, can’t have infinite regress.

Indeed, the reason the universe begins in a compressed state is to maximize the density for purposes of holding as much retrocausal information as possible. The universe wouldn’t need this squeeze play, if infinite density were real. Sorry, no infinite regress. You really ought to consider superdeterminism, because it’s probably true.



Dude, I’m going to put this to you very simply:

Existence never began. If it did begin, that means something had to have come from nothing. Nothing (by definition) isn’t there. That means that existence by logical proof is infinite.

Ask me more. I know you want god to exist. I get it. Let’s continue this discussion if you want to.
Ecmandu
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 11935
Joined: Thu Dec 11, 2014 1:22 am

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby Meno_ » Sat Apr 24, 2021 3:26 am

I tend to agree with John. The bottom part of a logically founded substratum is much heavier eidectically then the existentially progressive ascendency of life.

The gravity function of 'Being' far outweighs the evolutionary objective of the ascending instability.

That accounts for the growing hesitency in acclaiming endless .odes if ever widening sets of simulation.

It is, as if, the levels of reality which the ancients described as turtles resting on a vertical axis, are pre-figured contra-indicatively as getting smaller from a large toward a very small vanishing single turtle.

Pyramids also apply such a scheme, and the base substance of these similar basis of reference add to the contrary notion of modern physics as really the tip of the possible levels of energy expanded through analysis.

The product of analysis approaches the absurd notion of messing with subordinate levels of apprehension which is contrary to any objective representation of underlying levels of multiform simulation.

However, the real object of a constancy of preacquired eternal simulation , is probably to reconstruct an original continuos pattern of design, with near perfect unbounded schematic patterns, that need to open up increasing gaps of energy transfer( between inorganic and organic criteria for example); to transform the unity into a multiplicity of possible arrangements.

In other words, analysis for Itself is transformed into the discovery of many forms of relationships, which at a certain maximum apex, need to return to the same self conceived self. Otherwise Self is devolved into pure motive of objectivocation as a form of self determination, and becomes a mere axiomatically determined self of assimilation.
Last edited by Meno_ on Sat Apr 24, 2021 5:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
Meno_
breathless
 
Posts: 9007
Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2015 2:39 am
Location: Mysterium Tremendum

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby Ecmandu » Sat Apr 24, 2021 4:23 am

Meno,

Per the god theory, everyone constantly evolves except god.

I don’t see existence that way.
Ecmandu
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 11935
Joined: Thu Dec 11, 2014 1:22 am

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby Meno_ » Sat Apr 24, 2021 5:30 am

Ecmandu wrote:Meno,

Per the god theory, everyone constantly evolves except god.

I don’t see existence that way.


In an anthromorphically interpreted God , god=man and his aspirations, ergo it changes god along with God.

God becomes an absolute ideal form. If He would not exist, man would cease to be.

That's a little different from what You are saying.
Meno_
breathless
 
Posts: 9007
Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2015 2:39 am
Location: Mysterium Tremendum

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby JohnJBannan » Sat Apr 24, 2021 9:55 am

Ecmando,

I will also put it quite simply for you. Creation happened. God is necessary.

If you would like a philosophical proof besides the scientific SD argument I presented here, then it goes like this:

Something’s got to be uncaused. An uncaused thing cannot be made of parts else it would be caused by those parts. Hence, an uncaused thing without parts must be real and be capable of creating physical reality. That isn’t nothing. It’s God.
Last edited by JohnJBannan on Sat Apr 24, 2021 9:57 am, edited 3 times in total.
JohnJBannan
Philosopher
 
Posts: 1365
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 1:31 pm

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby JohnJBannan » Sat Apr 24, 2021 9:56 am

JohnJBannan wrote:Ecmando,

I will also put it quite simply for you. Creation happened. God is necessary.

If you would like a philosophical proof besides the scientific SD argument I presented here, then it goes like this:

Something’s got to be uncaused. An uncaused thing cannot be made of parts else it would be caused bu those parts. Hence, an uncaused without parts must be real and be capable of creating physical reality. That isn’t nothing. It’s God.


You really ought to start thinking about superdeterminism, because it’s likely true.

Superdeterminism also has a fascinating aspect to it, which I call the SD force. It’s a force that brings the predetermined future together based on retrocausal information contained in the initial correlations established at the Big Bang. The SD force can be used to explain abiogenesis and other things.
JohnJBannan
Philosopher
 
Posts: 1365
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 1:31 pm

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby promethean75 » Sat Apr 24, 2021 10:37 am

I will be submitting your thesis to the george martin institute for metatheological studies for review. Fun fact; two of John Stuart Mills's cousin's grandchildren are practicing professors and scholars at the institute.
promethean75
Philosopher
 
Posts: 4700
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2019 7:10 pm

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby JohnJBannan » Sat Apr 24, 2021 10:48 am

If you stop and think about retrocausality under superdetermism, you would figure out quite quickly that the information on the design of life must be contained in the initial correlations established at the Big Bang, which I call SD information. This SD information must be accessible in superdeterminism, and does explain that abiogenesis must have occurred with the aid of SD information where life is orchestrated into existence by the SD force.

However, because SD information ultimately originates with the creation of the universe, then God is the ultimate provider of SD information and the ultimate designer of life.
JohnJBannan
Philosopher
 
Posts: 1365
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 1:31 pm

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby Meno_ » Sat Apr 24, 2021 4:19 pm

That creates a necessary linkage between the human brain computer and the being Existance of the cosmically recurring reality simulation. It's like the anology of the brain being a doorway in and through which the cosmos manifests it'self, and the most that could be said is that such manifestation transfer of the various forms of energy is what god is all about. In that way the energy in its many gross forms really consists of a single source, and it is the unmoved mover, both potentially and actually, where there is no difference between them.

All states of energy produce the doorway to and through neural description and identification of all possible aspects of perception through analysis, except minus 1, that is It's Self, which can not preceded to form an identical 1 to form another exactly identical.

Therefore, Leibnitz must have erred.?
Meno_
breathless
 
Posts: 9007
Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2015 2:39 am
Location: Mysterium Tremendum

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby Ecmandu » Sat Apr 24, 2021 4:32 pm

John,

Platonic forms are uncaused. They are not sentient. Even your hypothetical god needs platonic forms to exist. New here’s the deal dude. ALL of us were never born and ALL of us never die.

That’s boring as fuck. So is knowing everything by the way. Boring as fuck.

So, we as spirits got together to make our best plan AT THE TIME! To keep us entertained forever. Lots of things went into this plan. Birth, death, reincarnation, enlightenment and god.

I’m the being with existence 2.0 in my spirit. The old plan doesn’t work. It has chasmic flaws.

I know as I’m typing this that you have very little clue what I’m talking about or that a person like me is even possible.
Ecmandu
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 11935
Joined: Thu Dec 11, 2014 1:22 am

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby JohnJBannan » Sat Apr 24, 2021 4:39 pm

Ecmandu wrote:John,

Platonic forms are uncaused. They are not sentient. Even your hypothetical god needs platonic forms to exist. New here’s the deal dude. ALL of us were never born and ALL of us never die.

That’s boring as fuck. So is knowing everything by the way. Boring as fuck.

So, we as spirits got together to make our best plan AT THE TIME! To keep us entertained forever. Lots of things went into this plan. Birth, death, reincarnation, enlightenment and god.

I’m the being with existence 2.0 in my spirit. The old plan doesn’t work. It has chasmic flaws.

I know as I’m typing this that you have very little clue what I’m talking about or that a person like me is even possible.


Platonic forms exist in God’s uncaused mind. We are creations - not gods.
JohnJBannan
Philosopher
 
Posts: 1365
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 1:31 pm

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby Meno_ » Sat Apr 24, 2021 4:44 pm

God seeded oud minds with Himself, so that He is both intrinsic and extrinsic.There is appearent parts of God therefore He is both caused and uncaused.
Meno_
breathless
 
Posts: 9007
Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2015 2:39 am
Location: Mysterium Tremendum

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby JohnJBannan » Sat Apr 24, 2021 4:46 pm

Meno_ wrote:God seeded oud minds with Himself, so that He is both intrinsic and extrinsic.There is appearent parts of God therefore He is both caused and uncaused.

God is only uncaused. God’s power to create physical reality is uncaused. There is no part of an uncaused power that need be caused.
JohnJBannan
Philosopher
 
Posts: 1365
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 1:31 pm

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby Ecmandu » Sat Apr 24, 2021 4:48 pm

JohnJBannan wrote:
Ecmandu wrote:John,

Platonic forms are uncaused. They are not sentient. Even your hypothetical god needs platonic forms to exist. New here’s the deal dude. ALL of us were never born and ALL of us never die.

That’s boring as fuck. So is knowing everything by the way. Boring as fuck.

So, we as spirits got together to make our best plan AT THE TIME! To keep us entertained forever. Lots of things went into this plan. Birth, death, reincarnation, enlightenment and god.

I’m the being with existence 2.0 in my spirit. The old plan doesn’t work. It has chasmic flaws.

I know as I’m typing this that you have very little clue what I’m talking about or that a person like me is even possible.


Platonic forms exist in God’s uncaused mind. We are creations - not gods.


Platonic forms exist in every mind. Minds require them.

We are eternal beings John. God didn’t make us. We made god. You really don’t get it man. Sure, there’s kind of a god, it was part of our plan (collective plan).

God cannot override the collective plan. That’s part of the plan as well. We all have to get together and change it together.

By the way, you responded to almost nothing from my post before this. Anyone who saw you quote it can see this.
Ecmandu
ILP Legend
 
Posts: 11935
Joined: Thu Dec 11, 2014 1:22 am

Re: The Superdeterministic Design (SD) Argument for God

Postby Meno_ » Sat Apr 24, 2021 4:53 pm

JohnJBannan wrote:
Meno_ wrote:God seeded oud minds with Himself, so that He is both intrinsic and extrinsic.There is appearent parts of God therefore He is both caused and uncaused.

God is only uncaused. God’s power to create physical reality is uncaused. There is no part of an uncaused power that need be caused.




I digree. The source of God's manifestation is mostly through a biblical manifestation which was man's doing
Meno_
breathless
 
Posts: 9007
Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2015 2:39 am
Location: Mysterium Tremendum

Next

Return to Philosophy



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot]