David Icke: what do people see in him?

The origins of the imperative, "know thyself", are lost in the sands of time, but the age-old examination of human consciousness continues here.

David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby Maia » Sun Aug 08, 2021 7:33 pm

I've recently started reading David Icke's Everything You Need to Know But Have Never Been Told, as I've never read anything by him before and I thought I'd give it a go. It's available as a free PDF file, here:

https://oiipdf.com/everything-you-need- ... david-icke

I'm still only a short way in and I have to say that it's awful. His style is like he's lecturing to a naughty five-year-old, and the content is pretty much appropriate for that age group, too. I seriously doubt that I'll finish it.

So my question is, why on earth is he so famous and influential?
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby iambiguous » Sun Aug 08, 2021 7:57 pm

Maia wrote:I've recently started reading David Icke's Everything You Need to Know But Have Never Been Told, as I've never read anything by him before and I thought I'd give it a go. It's available as a free PDF file, here:

https://oiipdf.com/everything-you-need- ... david-icke

I'm still only a short way in and I have to say that it's awful. His style is like he's lecturing to a naughty five-year-old, and the content is pretty much appropriate for that age group, too. I seriously doubt that I'll finish it.

So my question is, why on earth is he so famous and influential?


Well, as you are reading the book, note something that he believes we need to know but have never been told.

What evidence does he provide for thinking this?

Is it something that exist in the either/or world in which there is in fact evidence to support believing one thing rather than another? Or is it something that exist in the is/ought world in which different people believe different, often conflicting things. The part that those like me attribute to dasein.

I had to Google him myself, having never heard the name.

Wiki describes him as a "conspiracy theorist".

Here's the first:

Infinite dimensions

Icke believes that the universe is made up of "vibrational" energy, and consists of an infinite number of dimensions that share the same space, just like television and radio frequencies, and that some people can tune their consciousness to other wavelengths. He stated in an interview with The Guardian that:

Our five senses can access only a tiny frequency range, like a radio tuned to one station. In the space you are occupying now are all the radio and television stations broadcasting to your area. You can't see them and they can't see each other because they are on different wavelengths. But move your radio dial and suddenly there they are, one after the other. It is the same with the reality we experience here as "life". What we call the "world" and the "universe" is only one frequency range in an infinite number sharing the same space.

Icke believes that time is an illusion; there is no past, or future, and only the "infinite now" is real, and that humans are an aspect of consciousness, or infinite awareness, which he describes as "all that there is, has been, and ever can be".


You know me. I am far less interested in what someone believes and far more in intrigued with how existentially they came to believe it. In other words, given different experiences, not something else instead. And then the extent to which they can actually demonstrate to others that all rational human beings are obligated to believe the same. There must be zillions of beliefs about all manner of things relating to the universe and our place in it. But what is actually able to be proven?

His assumptions sound ludicrous to me but then what that do I know about infinite dimensions?

Anyone here familiar with his thinking? What actual "peer reviewed" evidence is there for believing this?
He was like a man who wanted to change all; and could not; so burned with his impotence; and had only me, an infinitely small microcosm to convert or detest. John Fowles

Start here: http://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtopi ... 1&t=176529
Then here: http://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtopi ... 5&t=185296
And here: http://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtopi ... 1&t=194382

"Sure, it works in practice, but does it work in theory?"

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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby Flannel Jesus » Sun Aug 08, 2021 8:18 pm

Maia wrote:...His style is like he's lecturing to a naughty five-year-old...

So my question is, why on earth is he so famous and influential?


That actually might be *why*. Some people are very vulnerable to this type of discourse. This is how the Christian Bible speaks to people too. How many verses in the Bible are there that say something like "Fools will deny me" or something like that?
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby Maia » Sun Aug 08, 2021 8:39 pm

iambiguous wrote:
Maia wrote:I've recently started reading David Icke's Everything You Need to Know But Have Never Been Told, as I've never read anything by him before and I thought I'd give it a go. It's available as a free PDF file, here:

https://oiipdf.com/everything-you-need- ... david-icke

I'm still only a short way in and I have to say that it's awful. His style is like he's lecturing to a naughty five-year-old, and the content is pretty much appropriate for that age group, too. I seriously doubt that I'll finish it.

So my question is, why on earth is he so famous and influential?


Well, as you are reading the book, note something that he believes we need to know but have never been told.

What evidence does he provide for thinking this?

Is it something that exist in the either/or world in which there is in fact evidence to support believing one thing rather than another? Or is it something that exist in the is/ought world in which different people believe different, often conflicting things. The part that those like me attribute to dasein.

I had to Google him myself, having never heard the name.

Wiki describes him as a "conspiracy theorist".

Here's the first:

Infinite dimensions

Icke believes that the universe is made up of "vibrational" energy, and consists of an infinite number of dimensions that share the same space, just like television and radio frequencies, and that some people can tune their consciousness to other wavelengths. He stated in an interview with The Guardian that:

Our five senses can access only a tiny frequency range, like a radio tuned to one station. In the space you are occupying now are all the radio and television stations broadcasting to your area. You can't see them and they can't see each other because they are on different wavelengths. But move your radio dial and suddenly there they are, one after the other. It is the same with the reality we experience here as "life". What we call the "world" and the "universe" is only one frequency range in an infinite number sharing the same space.

Icke believes that time is an illusion; there is no past, or future, and only the "infinite now" is real, and that humans are an aspect of consciousness, or infinite awareness, which he describes as "all that there is, has been, and ever can be".


You know me. I am far less interested in what someone believes and far more in intrigued with how existentially they came to believe it. In other words, given different experiences, not something else instead. And then the extent to which they can actually demonstrate to others that all rational human beings are obligated to believe the same. There must be zillions of beliefs about all manner of things relating to the universe and our place in it. But what is actually able to be proven?

His assumptions sound ludicrous to me but then what that do I know about infinite dimensions?

Anyone here familiar with his thinking? What actual "peer reviewed" evidence is there for believing this?


Well, since he has provided no evidence, at least so far, that might be difficult.

He has, however, provided an auto-biographical introduction at the beginning, if you want to have a look, which describes how he came to hold these beliefs. It's both overly tedious and overtly tendentious, and it's definitely all downhill from there.

He's the one, incidentally, who notoriously came out with the claim that the royal family are actually shapeshifting alien reptiles, though I think he might have rowed back a bit on that, now, saying it was intended as a metaphor.
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby Maia » Sun Aug 08, 2021 8:44 pm

Flannel Jesus wrote:
Maia wrote:...His style is like he's lecturing to a naughty five-year-old...

So my question is, why on earth is he so famous and influential?


That actually might be *why*. Some people are very vulnerable to this type of discourse. This is how the Christian Bible speaks to people too. How many verses in the Bible are there that say something like "Fools will deny me" or something like that?


Yes, it's very clear that he seems to be trying to start a religion, complete with its own dogmas and heretics.
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby iambiguous » Sun Aug 08, 2021 10:07 pm

Maia wrote:Well, since he has provided no evidence, at least so far, that might be difficult.


Since you are reading the book, if you do come upon any compelling evidence please let us know about it. Especially in regard to things he thinks we should know about pertaining to moral, political and spiritual values. My own particular interest -- obsession? -- in regard to either philosophy or human psychology. The mind when confronted with conflicting goods.

Maia wrote:He has, however, provided an auto-biographical introduction at the beginning, if you want to have a look, which describes how he came to hold these beliefs. It's both overly tedious and overtly tendentious, and it's definitely all downhill from there.


Can you cite an example or two of this?

Maia wrote:He's the one, incidentally, who notoriously came out with the claim that the royal family are actually shapeshifting alien reptiles, though I think he might have rowed back a bit on that, now, saying it was intended as a metaphor.


On the other hand, if he hasn't rowed back on it, I would certainly be interested in noting any actual proof that this is the case. Whereas, again, for me, the more interesting questions revolve around such things as the debate over whether there should even be a royal family at all. All the pros and cons there: https://soapboxie.com/government/Pros-a ... f-Monarchy

Does David Icke have an opinion on that?
He was like a man who wanted to change all; and could not; so burned with his impotence; and had only me, an infinitely small microcosm to convert or detest. John Fowles

Start here: http://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtopi ... 1&t=176529
Then here: http://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtopi ... 5&t=185296
And here: http://www.ilovephilosophy.com/viewtopi ... 1&t=194382

"Sure, it works in practice, but does it work in theory?"

Danny Embling: "People wonder how Hitler managed to get so many followers...it's never surprised me."
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby Maia » Sun Aug 08, 2021 11:28 pm

iambiguous wrote:
Maia wrote:Well, since he has provided no evidence, at least so far, that might be difficult.


Since you are reading the book, if you do come upon any compelling evidence please let us know about it. Especially in regard to things he thinks we should know about pertaining to moral, political and spiritual values. My own particular interest -- obsession? -- in regard to either philosophy or human psychology. The mind when confronted with conflicting goods.

Maia wrote:He has, however, provided an auto-biographical introduction at the beginning, if you want to have a look, which describes how he came to hold these beliefs. It's both overly tedious and overtly tendentious, and it's definitely all downhill from there.


Can you cite an example or two of this?

Maia wrote:He's the one, incidentally, who notoriously came out with the claim that the royal family are actually shapeshifting alien reptiles, though I think he might have rowed back a bit on that, now, saying it was intended as a metaphor.


On the other hand, if he hasn't rowed back on it, I would certainly be interested in noting any actual proof that this is the case. Whereas, again, for me, the more interesting questions revolve around such things as the debate over whether there should even be a royal family at all. All the pros and cons there: https://soapboxie.com/government/Pros-a ... f-Monarchy

Does David Icke have an opinion on that?


This will give you a flavour. He is the persecuted outsider, shunned and hated by all:

+++I am closing in on 30 years since I was first dubbed the maddest man in
Britain and most other places come to that. Newspaper headlines
delighted in my alleged madness and I was a comedian’s dream.
Mention of my name was enough to get a laugh with no joke necessary. I
was the joke.
But, as it turns out, they were the joke all along.
They didn’t know (and neither did I) that what they perceived as
madness was a mind emerging from the collective madness which is
called normality ... the madness that masquerades as sanity ... the coma-
sleep that believes it is wide awake. There are none so enslaved as those
who wrongly believe they are free, and none so crazy as those who
wrongly believe they are sane. Today as truly intelligent people look in
my direction from literally all over the world it can safely be said that
rumours of my madness were greatly exaggerated.+++

And then later after a career on TV, which accounts for why he was already well known in the UK, he is given his mission, by a famous medium:

+++He is a healer who is here to heal the Earth and he will be world famous.
He is still a child spiritually, but he will be given the spiritual riches.
Sometimes he will say things and wonder where they came from. They will be
our words.
Knowledge will be put into his mind, and at other times he will be led to
knowledge.
He was chosen as a youngster for his courage. He has been tested and has
passed all the tests.
He was led into football to learn discipline, but when that was learned it was
time to move on. He also had to learn how to cope with disappointment,
experience all the emotions, and how to get up and get on with it. The
spiritual way is tough and no one makes it easy.
He will always have what he needs, but no
more.
He will face enormous opposition, but we will always be there to protect him.+++

If any evidence exists for the royal family being shapeshifting alien reptiles, then I too would be very interested to know what it is, though I strongly suspect that none is likely to be forthcoming. I think it's safe to say that David Icke doesn't like them very much, though.

I think that a constitutional monarchy where the reserve powers of the Crown are used to defend democracy and the rule of law, is a very good thing. It brings continuity and stability. It's true that it occasionally throws up a completely unsuitable character to occupy the throne, as with Edward VIII in 1936, but he was forced out in less than a year.
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby Maia » Mon Aug 09, 2021 9:31 am

He starts the main part of the book with a paragraph that sounds like a cross between Madame Blavatsky and Lewis Carroll:

+++Once upon a no-time, in a ‘land’ called Forever, there was only
Awareness in awareness of itself – all-possibility and all-potential
waiting to manifest. There was no form, only the potential
imagination of form of every possible kind. This was the infinite state of
pure awareness from which all that we think we ‘see’ has ultimately
come.+++

After quite a lot of stuff about how there is no such thing as solidity, because of the nature of atoms, which in my opinion completely misses the point, because that's what solidity actually is, he's back to auto-biography again, this time with him getting out of his face on a hallucinogenic plant in Brazil. A discarnate voice kept repeating to him:

+++All you really need to know is Infinite Love is the only truth – everything
else is illusion.+++

Pretty standard stuff really, for the New Age, if a little vapid. His main problem here, I think, is to take what discarnated voices say to him as some sort of profound truth. He goes on:

+++In that moment I saw a shimmering, radiant blackness of
stillness and silence that somehow shone with incredible brilliance. What
was that again– a shimmering, radiant blackness that shone with the
brilliance of light? Ugh? Words do not exist to describe what appears to
be a bewildering contradiction to the human conscious mind (Fig 13).+++

Well, I'm not even going to try and get my head around that, but he seems to think that this experience is proof that near death experiences are objectively real, which he then goes on about at great length. A little actual evidence here would be a great help.

And that's as far as I've got.
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby Flannel Jesus » Mon Aug 09, 2021 9:45 am

Sounds like an absolutely unbearable read. A mentally ill guy who's convinced he's something between a genius and a Messiah. And with no editor apparently either.
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby Maia » Mon Aug 09, 2021 9:48 am

Flannel Jesus wrote:Sounds like an absolutely unbearable read. A mentally ill guy who's convinced he's something between a genius and a Messiah. And with no editor apparently either.


Unbearable for sure, like wading knee-deep through mud. And not surprisingly, it appears that all his books are published by his own publishing company.
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby Flannel Jesus » Mon Aug 09, 2021 10:01 am

Yeah, his Wikipedia page says he had to go self published after he started supporting some "Jews are trying to take over the world" conspiracy book that was shown to be a forgery. That's apparently too far for these publishers lol
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby Maia » Mon Aug 09, 2021 10:04 am

Flannel Jesus wrote:Yeah, his Wikipedia page says he had to go self published after he started supporting some "Jews are trying to take over the world" conspiracy book that was shown to be a forgery. That's apparently too far for these publishers lol


I think he tried to pass that off by saying that he didn't really mean Jews, but rather, aliens. Or something. It gets a little confusing. It's astonishing how popular he is though, drawing massive crowds of thousands on his tours.
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby MagsJ » Mon Aug 09, 2021 10:36 am

_
Icke is one of many presenters on Ancient Aliens, which I do watch, in which they look into socio-archeological anomalies that cannot be explained by Science.. he was also a footballer.
The possibility of anything we can imagine existing is endless and infinite.. ~MagsJ

I haven't got the time to spend the time reading something that is telling me nothing, as I will never be able to get back that time, and I may need it for something important at some point in time.. Huh!? ~MagsJ

You’re suggestions and I just simply don’t mix.. like oil on water, or a very bad DJ ~MagsJ

Examine what is said, not him who speaks ~Arab proverb

aes Sanātana Dharma Pali: the eternal way ~it should not be rigid, but inclusive of the best of all knowledge for the sake of Ṛta.. which is endless.
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby Maia » Mon Aug 09, 2021 11:04 am

MagsJ wrote:_
Icke is one of many presenters on Ancient Aliens, which I do watch, in which they look into socio-archeological anomalies that cannot be explained by Science.. he was also a footballer.


Would you say that Ancient Aliens, as a rule, is reliable? I've heard both good and bad things about it.
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby MagsJ » Mon Aug 09, 2021 2:56 pm

Maia wrote:Would you say that Ancient Aliens, as a rule, is reliable? I've heard both good and bad things about it.

Well.. it’s entertaining, and I find some of the topics spoken about very thought-provoking.. like ancient Indian texts talking of weapons right out of Marvel, but it’s vice versa.. Marvel basing weapons on ancient Indian texts.

Pyramids all over the world and under water
Huge ancient architectural religious structures
Unexplainable ‘questionable’ anthropological human bones
WMDs mentioned in ancient texts all around the world
The possibility of anything we can imagine existing is endless and infinite.. ~MagsJ

I haven't got the time to spend the time reading something that is telling me nothing, as I will never be able to get back that time, and I may need it for something important at some point in time.. Huh!? ~MagsJ

You’re suggestions and I just simply don’t mix.. like oil on water, or a very bad DJ ~MagsJ

Examine what is said, not him who speaks ~Arab proverb

aes Sanātana Dharma Pali: the eternal way ~it should not be rigid, but inclusive of the best of all knowledge for the sake of Ṛta.. which is endless.
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby Flannel Jesus » Mon Aug 09, 2021 3:01 pm

I've missed you MagsJ
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby Sculptor » Mon Aug 09, 2021 3:03 pm

Icke is a kook.
In the UK, where we know him, he is a joke.
There is nothing worthy in any thing he says.
The fact that he claims to be Jesus should have alerted you to that.
He is a man of limited intelligence and severly limited education.
He left school at 15 to join a football club where he made his money.
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby Sculptor » Mon Aug 09, 2021 3:08 pm

MagsJ wrote:_
Icke is one of many presenters on Ancient Aliens, which I do watch, in which they look into socio-archeological anomalies that cannot be explained by Science.. he was also a footballer.


Ancient Aliens is all fake.
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby Maia » Mon Aug 09, 2021 3:31 pm

MagsJ wrote:
Maia wrote:Would you say that Ancient Aliens, as a rule, is reliable? I've heard both good and bad things about it.

Well.. it’s entertaining, and I find some of the topics spoken about very thought-provoking.. like ancient Indian texts talking of weapons right out of Marvel, but it’s vice versa.. Marvel basing weapons on ancient Indian texts.

Pyramids all over the world and under water
Huge ancient architectural religious structures
Unexplainable ‘questionable’ anthropological human bones
WMDs mentioned in ancient texts all around the world


I've read about all of those things. Indian weapons, which sound suspiciously like nuclear weapons, though on a scale even bigger than the ones we have today. Underwater structures, and not just pyramids either, but all sorts of other types of buildings. Even the supposed bones of giants, which then mysteriously disappear.

Legends of lost civilisations are fascinating, with or without weapons of mass destruction, but I would always hesitate to ascribe them to aliens, rather than human ingenuity.
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby MagsJ » Mon Aug 09, 2021 4:45 pm

Flannel Jesus wrote:I've missed you MagsJ

Aw, that’s so kind FJ.. where have you been? I missed not seeing you around the board for ages.
The possibility of anything we can imagine existing is endless and infinite.. ~MagsJ

I haven't got the time to spend the time reading something that is telling me nothing, as I will never be able to get back that time, and I may need it for something important at some point in time.. Huh!? ~MagsJ

You’re suggestions and I just simply don’t mix.. like oil on water, or a very bad DJ ~MagsJ

Examine what is said, not him who speaks ~Arab proverb

aes Sanātana Dharma Pali: the eternal way ~it should not be rigid, but inclusive of the best of all knowledge for the sake of Ṛta.. which is endless.
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby Flannel Jesus » Mon Aug 09, 2021 4:48 pm

Just living, working, playing games, learning to paint. Over the last 6 years I've hit my lowest lows and my highest highs - my lows were pretty fucking low, and my highs were ... adequate. Lucky enough to find a wonderful love that I live with now.

I'm in England now, btw, don't know if you knew that. Hi neighbor!

How have you been?
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby MagsJ » Mon Aug 09, 2021 5:14 pm

Sculptor wrote:
MagsJ wrote:_
Icke is one of many presenters on Ancient Aliens, which I do watch, in which they look into socio-archeological anomalies that cannot be explained by Science.. he was also a footballer.


Ancient Aliens is all fake.

I watch it, because of the points I made in reply to Maia’s inquiry.. a lot of the content is based on unfounded assumptions, but.. like I said, I find the socio-anthropological content most interesting.

Do you not find anything about the series the least bit interesting or intriguing?
The possibility of anything we can imagine existing is endless and infinite.. ~MagsJ

I haven't got the time to spend the time reading something that is telling me nothing, as I will never be able to get back that time, and I may need it for something important at some point in time.. Huh!? ~MagsJ

You’re suggestions and I just simply don’t mix.. like oil on water, or a very bad DJ ~MagsJ

Examine what is said, not him who speaks ~Arab proverb

aes Sanātana Dharma Pali: the eternal way ~it should not be rigid, but inclusive of the best of all knowledge for the sake of Ṛta.. which is endless.
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby MagsJ » Mon Aug 09, 2021 5:29 pm

Flannel Jesus wrote:Just living, working, playing games, learning to paint. Over the last 6 years I've hit my lowest lows and my highest highs - my lows were pretty fucking low, and my highs were ... adequate. Lucky enough to find a wonderful love that I live with now.

I'm in England now, btw, don't know if you knew that. Hi neighbor!

How have you been?

I didn’t, no.. well hello, neighbour. :)

I hope us Brits are treating you well, and not making you regret your move? A cool reason to have come to England over, I must say. :D

I had a major crash a few years back, from a vax injury, and it’s been the slowest crawl ever back to rebuilding my health and energy-levels.. there was no time for a wonderful love, but there is now. : )
Last edited by MagsJ on Mon Aug 09, 2021 5:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The possibility of anything we can imagine existing is endless and infinite.. ~MagsJ

I haven't got the time to spend the time reading something that is telling me nothing, as I will never be able to get back that time, and I may need it for something important at some point in time.. Huh!? ~MagsJ

You’re suggestions and I just simply don’t mix.. like oil on water, or a very bad DJ ~MagsJ

Examine what is said, not him who speaks ~Arab proverb

aes Sanātana Dharma Pali: the eternal way ~it should not be rigid, but inclusive of the best of all knowledge for the sake of Ṛta.. which is endless.
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby Flannel Jesus » Mon Aug 09, 2021 5:31 pm

I'm having a good time here now. Got some good mates, and none of them like David Icke which I'm pleased about.

I love the Tate museum btw - I don't live anywhere near, but I'd visit it every week if I could!
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Re: David Icke: what do people see in him?

Postby Dan~ » Mon Aug 09, 2021 7:58 pm

Sculptor wrote:
MagsJ wrote:_
Icke is one of many presenters on Ancient Aliens, which I do watch, in which they look into socio-archeological anomalies that cannot be explained by Science.. he was also a footballer.

Ancient Aliens is all fake.

Sculptors are all fake.
I like http://www.accuradio.com , internet radio.
https://dannerz.itch.io/ -- a new and minimal webside now hosting my free game projects.
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Truth is based in sensing, in vision. And we can only see when we are alive.
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Dan~
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